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  #1  
Old 11-14-2012, 11:09 AM
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Default Best argument against ("traditional") life after death

Hello All,
Recently I came to the conclusion tht there is indeed strong argument against "traditional" afterlife. It started about 2 months ago,when just in case I've read the book by Marcus Chown "The Universe Next Door".There is the Chapter "I'm gonna live forever". It has nothing to do with Parapsychology,but with the Everett's "Many Worlds" interpretation of quantum mechanics.The point is ,that as I searched on Internet,this interpretation has overwhelming support today among quantum physicists.For example,one of MWI evangelists,Lev Vaidman even built quantum device "The Quantum World Splitter",you can find it on Wikipedia.Also,follow this quote from one website,where person claimed to get e-mail from one physicist: ""It has never struck me before that people do not realise that there is MASSIVE observational evidence that the Many Worlds
really do exist.
In fact ALL the data associated with correlation indicates that the Many Worlds DO exist.
It is only really that there is an alternative explanation (Bohm's Quantum Potential) that such belief is not stronger.
We can SEE single particles in a Mach Zender interferometer or a Elitzur Vaidman Bomb Tester go BOTH WAYS around the
apparatus. We can SEE the Many Worlds in this way (and Many others).”

Previously popular Copehnagen interpretaion seems clearly out of picture today.

I don't know,may be above doesn't prove anything.Some people seem certain that MWI is obvious. And I had a correspondence with few physicists who don't accept this theory. But this is only half-point. The point is that this theory by itslef presuppose immortality,that is called" quantum immortality", meaning you will always find yourself only in the world when you survive,and there will be part of the wave where you don't die.You can find some of these discussions on the Internet.It was written in few books,and few philosophical papers.
But given all that it seems that all evidence for life after death we have from SPR and private investigators(mediumship,apparitions,reincarnation ) is moot point.Ironically,the above can be ascribed as support for ESP.Or,more generally,that we are forced to seek other explanations for survival evidence.
On the other hand - who knows,may be MWI of quantum mechanics is not the last word?(Hard to believe given the above quote and massive todays support).As I know leading proponents are in Oxford,Devid Deutch,Sammy Sunders,David Wallace ad others.Also Lev Vaidman in Israel.
Maybe quantum theory will be modified/replaced?Lee Smolin definetely thinks so.
I am in no rush to discard all evidence collected by the 150 last years, but the above makes me think...
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  #2  
Old 11-14-2012, 11:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexander1304 View Post
"this interpretation has overwhelming support today among quantum physicists."
This, of course, is quite different from 'this interpretation has support today among an overwhelming number of quantum physicists.'
Even from what you say, it is clear the that the MWI 'evangelists' are few in number.

As for "We can SEE single particles in a Mach Zender interferometer or a Elitzur Vaidman Bomb Tester go BOTH WAYS around the apparatus": this is quite false. The whole conclusion is that quantum interference is only seen when the individual paths are not observed.
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  #3  
Old 11-14-2012, 12:33 PM
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I've just read F. Tipler(ardent defender of many-worlds" that non-locality CAN be interpreted es evidence for Many -Worlds

By Frank Tipler | Response | 2012 Annual Question | Edge

An Brian Greene in his Universe or Multiverse says that everything we knew we MIGHT be wrong.He engages in a lot of "what-ifs".

Seems science inconlusive,so maybe "traditional" afterlife still has a chance...
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  #4  
Old 11-14-2012, 12:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexander1304 View Post
I've just read F. Tipler(ardent defender of many-worlds" that non-locality CAN be interpreted es evidence for Many -Worlds

By Frank Tipler | Response | 2012 Annual Question | Edge

An Brian Greene in his Universe or Multiverse says that everything we knew we MIGHT be wrong.He engages in a lot of "what-ifs".

Seems science inconlusive,so maybe "traditional" afterlife still has a chance...

The evidence from parapsychology, NDE research (and other similar fields) suggests (much more strongly than 'MIGHT be wrong') that existing science is woefully incomplete.

Parapsychological kinds of evidence are much stronger than any evidence for purely-physical parallel universes!
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  #5  
Old 11-14-2012, 01:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexander1304 View Post
people do not realise that there is MASSIVE observational evidence that the Many Worlds
really do exist.
My BS meter just went off the charts
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  #6  
Old 11-14-2012, 01:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EthanT View Post
My BS meter just went off the charts
Yeah mine kinda did too. From what I have read dark matter has more evidence for it, and even that seems dubious to me.
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  #7  
Old 11-14-2012, 02:05 PM
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Super-ESP advocates have been claiming things like this since SPR started saying they thought there was good reason to believe in the afterlife.
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  #8  
Old 11-14-2012, 02:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JCearley View Post
Super-ESP advocates have been claiming things like this since SPR started saying they thought there was good reason to believe in the afterlife.
I was waiting for You,Joshua. I'm surprised that our hardcore skeptics are not here yet - I gave them such good argument
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  #9  
Old 11-14-2012, 02:51 PM
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Ops,something I just found on one forum.May be related to my OP

"How can locality be preserved when splitting the universe is required
for quantum entanglement measurements to remain correlated? Splitting
universe doesn't seem like a local event to me."
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  #10  
Old 11-14-2012, 05:57 PM
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Just got e-mail from well known quantum physicist Sheldon Goldstein, about the expression above.I asked him if it is true,or matter of opinion.His response: "Matter of opinion. More precisely it is false, since the opinion that it is indeed required is simply not true."
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